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	<title>Contrarian Stock Market Investing News - Featuring Bargain Stocks &#187; Iron Ore Prices</title>
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		<title>China Plays Hardball with Iron Ore Producers, Seeking 82% Reduction in Price</title>
		<link>http://www.contrarianprofits.com/articles/china-plays-hardball-with-iron-ore-producers-seeking-82-reduction-in-price/9829</link>
		<comments>http://www.contrarianprofits.com/articles/china-plays-hardball-with-iron-ore-producers-seeking-82-reduction-in-price/9829#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 20:07:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Jason Simpkins</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Financial News]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[BHP]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Economic Downturn]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Iron Ore]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Iron Ore Prices]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Jason Simpkins]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[RIO]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[RTP]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Steel Demand]]></category>

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		<description><![CDATA[<p>China may soon ask the world”s top iron ore producers to reduce the prices they charge for the key steel component by as much as 82%.</p>
<p>Just months ago, BHP Billiton Ltd. (ADR: <a onclick="s_objectID=&#34;http://finance.google.com/finance?q=bhp_1&#34;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=bhp" target="_blank">BHP</a>), Rio Tinto PLC (ADR: <a onclick="s_objectID=&#34;http://finance.google.com/finance?q=rtp_1&#34;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=rtp" target="_blank">RTP</a>) and Brazil”s Vale (ADR: <a onclick="s_objectID=&#34;http://finance.google.com/finance?q=rio_1&#34;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=rio" target="_blank">RIO</a>) negotiated an 86%  price <em>increase </em>in the benchmark price of iron ore as demand for steel  boomed.</p>
<p>“<a onclick="s_objectID=&#34;http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&#38;sid=auJZI2qDNd6Y_1&#34;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&#38;sid=auJZI2qDNd6Y" target="_blank">Iron  ore prices should keep pace with steel prices which have fallen to the 1994  level</a>,” Shan Shanghua, secretary in general of the China Iron and Steel  Association, told <strong><em>Bloomberg</em></strong> in a phone interview. “We are asking  for a big drop in iron ore prices.”</p>
<p>Vale, the world”s largest iron ore producer set the stage for contract negotiations earlier this year when it&#8230;</p>]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>China may soon ask the world”s top iron ore producers to reduce the prices they charge for the key steel component by as much as 82%.<span id="more-9829"></span></p>
<p>Just months ago, BHP Billiton Ltd. (ADR: <a onclick="s_objectID=&quot;http://finance.google.com/finance?q=bhp_1&quot;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=bhp" target="_blank">BHP</a>), Rio Tinto PLC (ADR: <a onclick="s_objectID=&quot;http://finance.google.com/finance?q=rtp_1&quot;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=rtp" target="_blank">RTP</a>) and Brazil”s Vale (ADR: <a onclick="s_objectID=&quot;http://finance.google.com/finance?q=rio_1&quot;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=rio" target="_blank">RIO</a>) negotiated an 86%  price <em>increase </em>in the benchmark price of iron ore as demand for steel  boomed.</p>
<p>“<a onclick="s_objectID=&quot;http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&amp;sid=auJZI2qDNd6Y_1&quot;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&amp;sid=auJZI2qDNd6Y" target="_blank">Iron  ore prices should keep pace with steel prices which have fallen to the 1994  level</a>,” Shan Shanghua, secretary in general of the China Iron and Steel  Association, told <strong><em>Bloomberg</em></strong> in a phone interview. “We are asking  for a big drop in iron ore prices.”</p>
<p>Vale, the world”s largest iron ore producer set the stage for contract negotiations earlier this year when it secured a 70% increase in the benchmark price of its ore. BHP and Rio upped the ante by using their proximity to Asia as leverage to demand benchmark price increases that ranged from 80% to 97%. The average increase in benchmark iron ore prices paid by Chinese steelmakers was 86%.</p>
<p>Steel demand, output, and prices have declined substantially  since then, returning some leverage back to consumers.</p>
<p>The benchmark price, established in April, is paid only on material that meets certain specifications listed in the contract. Other material is sold at a discount to the contract price. Of course, considering the slump in steel demand that has accompanied the global economic downturn, it”s unlikely that BHP, Rio or Vale are getting anything close to their negotiated benchmark prices of about $100 per metric ton.</p>
<p>“It”s the reality that current contracts cannot be fulfilled,” Shan said. “Many bigger mills don”t need to import till the end of March, some even the end of May.”</p>
<p>But Chinese steelmakers still aren”t satisfied, and the government wants to take advantage of the opportunity to haggle down the exorbitant prices that producers squeezed out of Beijing last spring.</p>
<p>If Shan is serious about iron ore prices tracking those of steel, China will demand an 82% reduction in iron ore costs, according to <strong><em>Bloomberg</em></strong>. Benchmark contract iron ore fines sold by Rio Tinto, for instance, currently cost around $92.58 a metric ton. However, a return to the levels seen in 1994 would reduce that same iron to a cost of just $16.685 per metric ton.</p>
<p>China also wants the new contract prices to go into effect  Jan. 1, 2009, rather than April.</p>
<p>Of course, few analysts believe that China”s demands will be met &#8211; regardless of the tepid outlook for steel demand over the next year &#8211; and that this is more likely just a case of China giving the ore producers a taste of their own medicine by playing hardball.</p>
<p>“It”s going to be a difficult price negotiation as miners and mills are divided in the market outlook,” Helen Lau, a Shanghai-based analyst with <a onclick="s_objectID=&quot;http://finance.google.com/finance?q=Daiwa+Securities+_1&quot;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=Daiwa+Securities+" target="_blank">Daiwa  Securities Group Inc.</a> told <strong><em>Bloomberg</em></strong>. “But iron ore prices  are determined by demand, not steel prices. The association”s comment is part  of negotiating tactics.”</p>
<p>Source: <a class="titleref" onclick="s_objectID=&quot;http://www.moneymorning.com/2008/12/08/china-iron-ore/_1&quot;;return this.s_oc?this.s_oc(e):true" rel="bookmark" href="http://www.moneymorning.com/2008/12/08/china-iron-ore/">China Plays Hardball with Iron Ore Producers, Seeking 82%  Reduction in Price</a></p>
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		<title>Predator and Prey</title>
		<link>http://www.contrarianprofits.com/articles/predator-and-prey/1342</link>
		<comments>http://www.contrarianprofits.com/articles/predator-and-prey/1342#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Apr 2008 11:28:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Dan Denning</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Featured]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Financial News]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[International Investing]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Australia]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Bhp Billiton]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[china]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[ILU]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[inflation]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Iron Ore Prices]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[MIS]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[MMX]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[Ndrc]]></category>
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		<category><![CDATA[steel]]></category>
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		<description><![CDATA[<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8220;Who is the predator and who is the prey? That is what we wonder  today.&#8221; </font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8220;Is China preying on <strong>BHP Billiton</strong> (ASX: <a href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=ASX%3ABHP" target="_blank">BHP</a>)? Or is BHP preying on Rio? Who are the  barracudas and who are the minnows?&#8221; asks <a href="http://www.contrarianprofits.com/articles/author/dan-denning/"  class="alinks_links" onclick="return alinks_click(this);" title=""  style="padding-right: 13px; background: url(http://www.contrarianprofits.com/wp-content/plugins/alinks/images/external.png) center right no-repeat;" rel="external">Dan Denning</a> of the <a href="http://www.dailyreckoning.com.au/"  class="alinks_links" onclick="return alinks_click(this);" title=""  style="padding-right: 13px; background: url(http://www.contrarianprofits.com/wp-content/plugins/alinks/images/external.png) center right no-repeat;" rel="external">Daily Reckoning Australia</a>.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">Steel prices are up by about 10% this  year already.</font></p>
<p></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">First, the big fish. &#8220;With iron ore prices rising explosively,&#8221; says  China&#8217;s National Development Reform Commission (NDRC),  &#8220;many domestic  firms are very enthusiastic about investing in overseas mines, which  needs strengthened macro guidance from the country.&#8221;</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">Macro guidance is about what you&#8217;d expect from a nation that has  methodically and with stunning success, pulled itself from centrally  planned poverty to centrally planned prosperity (at least for some).  But what&#8230;</font></p>]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8220;Who is the predator and who is the prey? That is what we wonder  today.&#8221; </font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8220;Is China preying on <strong>BHP Billiton</strong> (ASX: <a href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=ASX%3ABHP" target="_blank">BHP</a>)? Or is BHP preying on Rio? Who are the  barracudas and who are the minnows?&#8221; asks <a href="http://www.contrarianprofits.com/articles/author/dan-denning/"  class="alinks_links" onclick="return alinks_click(this);" title=""  style="padding-right: 13px; background: url(http://www.contrarianprofits.com/wp-content/plugins/alinks/images/external.png) center right no-repeat;" rel="external">Dan Denning</a> of the <a href="http://www.dailyreckoning.com.au/"  class="alinks_links" onclick="return alinks_click(this);" title=""  style="padding-right: 13px; background: url(http://www.contrarianprofits.com/wp-content/plugins/alinks/images/external.png) center right no-repeat;" rel="external">Daily Reckoning Australia</a>.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">Steel prices are up by about 10% this  year already.</font></p>
<p><span id="more-1342"></span></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">First, the big fish. &#8220;With iron ore prices rising explosively,&#8221; says  China&#8217;s National Development Reform Commission (NDRC),  &#8220;many domestic  firms are very enthusiastic about investing in overseas mines, which  needs strengthened macro guidance from the country.&#8221;</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">Macro guidance is about what you&#8217;d expect from a nation that has  methodically and with stunning success, pulled itself from centrally  planned poverty to centrally planned prosperity (at least for some).  But what does &#8216;macro guidance&#8217; mean? GPS? RFID?</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;Today&#8217;s Australian has all the intriguing details on China&#8217;s Grand  Strategy towards Australia in a story titled, &#8220;Beijing takes over BHP  raid plans.&#8221; The comments from the NDRC are a fascinating take on how  at least some Chinese officials think capitalism works. &#8220;Globally, iron  ore mines that are of high quality and easy to exploit are basically in  the hands of major multinational companies. Our firms need to pay a  high cost to mine iron ore resources abroad. Their exploitation risks  and costs are increasing.&#8221;</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;Is it really &#8216;exploitation&#8217; to pay the market price for natural  resources? Or is that just the language of socialism? Perhaps a crash  course on free market economics is in order for the NDRC.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;Not to sound too condescending (this coming from someone who uses the  royal We), but you have to wonder if there is some wishful thinking  going on in Beijing. Or maybe, after having lost money in Blackstone  and Bear Stearns, state backed firms are wary of buying equity chunks  in public companies. Maybe they want a different arrangement.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;Either way, it is clear the Chinese have woken up to the fact that  the century is theirs for the taking. But there seems to be some  confusion about what rules the century is going to operate under: will  it be mostly free market rules&#8230;or other rules. The market price for  the resources China wants is rising. So it would prefer to not pay the  market price.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;By the way, we reckon free markets are headed for a bit of a bear  market. Globalisation, in the bastard form we find it (where trade  isn&#8217;t really free and currencies are manipulated regularly) has  produced US$114 oil, massive inflation, the worst credit crisis since  1929, food riots, and a growing popular backlash. Expect more direct  government intervention and regulation  in financial markets and,  perhaps, resource markets. That should play right into China&#8217;s hands,  actually.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;This latest line of probing rhetoric coming from China is not exactly  a new line of attack. After all, the resources are there for the taking  on the public markets. There&#8217;s no need to attack at all. But it does  feel like an attempt to flush out Australia&#8217;s politicians and get them  more involved in China&#8217;s plans for Australian resources. The government  is already involved, of course, with the Takeovers panel quashing the  bid by Shougang Steel and APAC resources to take a 40% stake in iron  ore up-and-comer <strong>Mt. Gibson</strong> (ASX:<a href="http://finance.google.com/finance?q=ASX%3AMGX" target="_blank">MGX</a>).</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;Let&#8217;s put this whole affair in the context of steel and GDP. We found  <a href="http://www.mineweb.com/mineweb/view/mineweb/en/page36?oid=51137&amp;sn=Detail" target="_blank">the chart</a> below yesterday while preparing for a radio interview with a  Canadian business show. The host wanted to know how steel companies  could afford to pay a 300% increase in coking coal prices and a 75%  increase in iron ore prices. We asked him to picture the chart below.</font></p>
<p align="center"><font face="Verdana" size="2"><strong>Steel and GDP, Marching Hand in Hand</strong><br />
<img src="http://www.dailyreckoning.com.au/images/20080417DRA.png" border="1" /><br />
<em>Source: Mining and commodities exports, Angelia Grant,<br />
John Hawkins and  Lachlan Shaw, 2006</em></font></p>
<p align="center"><font face="Verdana" size="2"><br />
</font></p>
<p align="left"><font face="Verdana" size="2"> &#8211;The chart shows that world steel production leapt ahead of GDP growth  during the two big periods of Asian industrialisation of the last 50  years, in Japan and Korea. With China now industrialising, and coming  off a much lower base in steel production, a period of growth in steel  production that exceeded world GDP would be quite the spectacle. It  would also mean China&#8217;s        consumption of base metals is just now hitting  high gear.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;From an Australian perspective, what&#8217;s so flabbergasting about the  chart is that both Korea and Japan have been devoted customers of the  black coal from the Bowen Basin that is so well suited for coking.  They&#8217;ve also been tied up for years as customers of Rio Tinto and BHP  for the iron ore that comes from the Pilbara. Now you add China to the  queue.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana" size="2">&#8211;Despite its surge to the top in terms of global steel production,  China&#8217;s individual steel firms are still smaller, at least according to  the latest figures from the International Iron and Steel Institute,  than Japan and Korea. Nippon Steel, Posco, and JFE are all bigger  producers than Baosteel. Keep in mind, however, that as recently as  2002, China was a net steel importer. It&#8217;s now a net exporter.</font></p>
<p align="center"><font face="Verdana" size="2"><img src="http://www.dailyreckoning.com.au/images/20080417DRB.png" border="1" /><br />
<em>Source: International Iron and Steel Institute</em></font></p>
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